Post by Biker Jacket Jones on Aug 21, 2012 21:17:16 GMT -5
Remember me, the pocket-man? I said in the topic here that I would post images soon. Well... I was sort of "wrong" about that. I don't have the proper equipment to take the proper pictures. However, what I can now do is provide a proper year-and-a-half ownership survey of my Gibson & Barnes lambskin Expedition as a way of saying thanks to this community for helping me decide what I wanted in my Indy jacket. I feel a sense of obligation to do so. Some of what I'm telling here I've already mentioned before, but most of it I haven't, and I believe the information from having had it for a year and a half could prove useful for someone.
I'll start by saying that I bought it used from a guy on eBay. He said he had it for three weeks and didn't like it because of the fit. I have no reason to doubt him, though I do wonder why he didn't simply return it. His loss and my gain, though, since I got a $300 discount just for three weeks of use, and he had other Indy jackets for sale, so it's possible he's encountered this before.
I'll start with perhaps the most important thing--the fit. If something doesn't fit, then no matter what, you're just not going to be happy with it. While the seller disclosed the size, I did by this used on eBay without being able to test-wear it, and the seller was upfront in the listing saying he wouldn't take returns. I went to their standard size chart to perform sizing checks to make sure the provided size would fit, though it matched my favorite and best-fitting sport coat in off-the-rack size, so I took the plunge. The jacket fit perfectly in every way I could imagine, and after a year and a half of wind, use, rain, and me trying to maintain my physique, it still fits perfectly. Gibson & Barnes easily has the most intelligent sizing of any jacket maker besides someone like the late Tony Nowak or Riley that does custom sizing exclusively. You can order to multiple even numbers, and you can go three lengths--short, regular, or tall. Most manufacturers don't even provide a short option. Of course, if you ask, they will also custom fit it like anyone else will, though that forfeits their return policy. This just further proves their versatility. U.S. Wings has very unintelligent sizing on most items. Just small, medium, large, x-large, xx-large, etc. No real way to specify fit. It's great it does happen to fit perfectly, but if not, too bad because there might not be anything in between. Wested provides more options, and is especially practical if you live in England and can spring for their custom fitting which isn't much money compared to most's offerings. However, if you don't live in their area and must order overseas, you can run into big issues and hassles if they got the sizing wrong. Of course, Wested may have cleared up their customer service issues since I was last here.
It would also be remiss of me to fail to mention that G&Bs customer service department will jump on any question you email them within hours and answer it completely and concisely with no end-around or vague answers.
The lambskin material itself.... After spending a lot of time here asking questions on how to best spec my jacket, I came to the ultimate conclusion that the best way to ensure I could ware my jacket in the largest diversity of climates, particularly considering where I live, lambskin would be best. Again, good choice. Call me nutty, but I find that I can actually wear it up to 100° F, though not without answering the occasional question from inquisitive people. It's certainly not like the heat-sink BiffMan seemed to describe here. With proper sweaters, layering, and a possible overcoat or pea coat (yes, you can fit a properly-sized pea coat over it if your particular jacket isn't over-sized), you can dip down to around freezing, though if you go too much below that, you might be wishing you had goatskin or something even stronger. Wearing the leather jacket in heat requires a few things. One of them is a cold-nature mentality that necessitates that you enjoy warm weather, such as myself. If you don't, it probably won't work out. You also have to be picky about the types of shirts you wear. Anything with long sleeves and you'll start to transform into bacon. Shirt collars, especially stiff ones or those awful polo shirt collars, will also act as a medical heat wrap for your neck, so forget that, as well. What you really need is one-layer only--a tee shirt (or henley if you prefer). I get ones with pockets not only for practicality, but to also to "spruce up" my image and not look lazy in my styling. Like thus, I actually find that, without zipping it up, it's actually cooler than if I had been wearing a basic undershirt with a regular long-sleeve shirt, buttoned or unbuttoned. The satin-like lining seems to help in this regard. Despite fears that it would be "clammy" in humidity and after sweating, I found that it actually has a semi-cooling effect against my bare arms. It also hasn't ever caught on my hands while taking it off or putting it on. Another factor is the fact that it's slightly roomier than a regular shirt (not to imply that it's over-sized or sized incorrectly, just that's it's sized like any normal jacket should be that fits properly--no one wants a skin-tight leather jacket that I know of). Point is, I've wore it everywhere in every kind of weather, and every kind of temperature that the average person will encounter, and it worked everywhere.
This is not at all to imply the lambskin is flimsy or fragile. It's certainly stronger than any shirt or sport coat you could buy. I've handled cats with it on before, and it's not something I'll do again. It's hit or miss in this regard--one cat began to struggle because it wanted down and actually slashed the left sleeve just beyond the shoulder. This didn't rip anything. It only left three small off-color distressed stripes that you really have to squint at and know they're there beforehand to even notice. There was no actual damage, tearing, or scratches on the surface. On the other hand, one other cat simply gripped the area close to the middle of the zipper-line. It left four tiny holes. No serious damage, but lesson learned--don't hold cats while wearing it. Other than this, it hasn't been damaged in the year and a half I've had it.
I mentioned the zipper earlier. After a few weeks of practice, I got to where I could grasp the zipper and zip it up slightly or all the way without it failing to catch properly or get stuck. It's smooth in operation. The left-hand "British" location of the pull doesn't phase me even slightly. It's as natural as if it was on the right.
I would like it to have Last Crusade-/Crystal Skull-style snaps at the top and bottom of the storm flap. Not a make-or-break deal, though, and the storm flap in general is a great idea for covering the zipper-line.
The front patch pockets are practical, too. Big enough that I can put stuff in them, and still have enough space to stuff my hands into the hand warmers. The underarm gussets are also a good idea.
One thing I have noticed is that the jacket has, at least as far as I can tell, distressed very little in the past year and a half, if at all. I also haven't noticed the jacket "deforming" to fit my body shape (not that it even needs to) like I've seen some of the members here talk about in reference to their own jackets. It's retained its color, which is the same rich dark brown that passes as black without proper lighting. It's also retained it's shape, though there are two faint and subtle lines along the front from hanging on a hanger. I got the biggest, broadest, and widest hanger I could find, not some small plastic hanger, or, heaven forbid, a wire hanger. I've heard of the pitfalls of using small plastic hangers. The lines themselves aren't notable while wearing it, and are only apparent while it's on the hanger. Like the claw marks, you have to know it's there in advance and where to look before you can notice it at all.
It's an interesting small little journey I took to get to this point. It started when I decided that I wanted a hat, but that a typical baseball cap lacked the sun protection of a regular hat, and that it wasn't as universally versatile. A cowboy/western hat fit the bill, but my wardrobe isn't western-themed, so that didn't seem perfect, either. Then I saw the Dorfman-Pacific oilcloth hat at a retailer. I recognized it immediately as Indiana Jones despite it not really being anything like an authentic hat. While I understand that Dorfman Pacific is at the low end in terms of authenticity, that wasn't my primary concern. I wanted a practical hat with a full brim that would shade my head and also provide versatile styling. I wear it out everywhere, from outdoors to public places to even church (though I obviously take it off once inside).
When the idea came to me what I wanted a practical jacket, I browsed the internet for options. That's how I discovered I could actually by my own Indy jacket. This is probably one of the last things that anyone here thinks about, but I actually choose the design for practicality and everyday-wear. Versatile in a wide range of climates. Quick zip-up design. Big pockets. It just does everything I want it to do.
Also, one of the last things I wanted was a flashy leather jacket that would make me stand out and attract undesired attention, so I wanted an understated design that would blend in in a crowd and not make myself look like a punk, someone that could club you at any moment, or someone that might be dealing in heroin. It does this, as well. I know this because I get far more comments from strangers about my "nice hat" than I do my Expedition. In fact, I've only gotten one such comment about my Expedition, and it was from a gentlemen operating an amusement park ride, asking if my jacket was too hot (the temperature was in the mid to upper 90s at the time).
While it's certainly true I bought the Expedition second hand, a scenario where I might have ended up with a jacket from any other manufacture, I must also point out that I had been searching eBay for months, and passed on a number of jackets. There were a number of U.S. Wings that had the wrong material, and those that had the correct material had the aforementioned ambiguous sizing. There were a number of Wested that were close in size, but were custom made and might have been wrong in one direction or another. Some had the wrong number of pockets, or something else wrong with the customizations that didn't set well. U.S. Wings even ran a special once--brand new Goatskin Indy jackets for $200, and not their imports--their "Signature Series" goatskins that were supposedly their best. I passed on that, as well. I could have gotten a brand new Todd's Costumes jacket for $150, but declined on that, as well (and this post was still fresh in memory, even though Kt. Templar's picture doesn't appear to be working, but for the curious, it showed one of his Todd's jacket's armpits having exploded). When I saw the G&B in that size, though... something just clicked. I knew it was the one. I put my bid out and got it for $200 (closer to $215 when you count the shipping, but that's going to happen with any manufacturer anyway). The fact that I was able to be confident enough with their sizing information and consistency despite buying second hand and not being able to try it before hand only goes to further demonstrate the simplicity of it all.
That's another thing that makes G&B great. If you go to their page, it's all very simple and laid out in front of you. You still have options and can still custom order if you want to, but you're not overwhelmed at the same time. If you go to U.S. Wings, you'll see a confusing number of models, and the same thing happens at Wested, though to an admittedly smaller degree. Really, the only thing wrong with their options is that you're limited to either lambskin or goatskin, and if you asked their customer service department, they might tell you that they're able to make it in their cowhide or horsehide as a custom made jacket.
In product reviews, I've found that most people will readily harp on a product if it's faulty or fails to deliver (like with the numerous Wested shipping issues in the past), but, and this might not necessarily be the case here, when a product is excellent and meets or exceeds expectations, people often find it harder to find the time to comment. I'm trying to buck that trend here, even if I seem somewhat-self absorbed. I want to establish an honest product review that may help prospective buyers.
I only own this one leather jacket, so I can't really say for sure if it or any other leather jacket is worth $500 (incidentally, the Expedition lambskin is now a $578 jacket due to Gibson & Barnes' price increase--they sure aren't skittish about telling you how good they think their jackets are). I've never spent that much, or even $200, on an article of clothing, and I can easily see someone choosing a U.S. Wings or Wested option because of the money involved. I will say that I'm extremely satisfied with my Expedition, and if you have the means and motivation to do something like this, you won't be choosing wrong if you choose G&B. It really goes to show that something is worth what you're willing to pay for it--my final bid was actually $275 (maybe $270, but that's a small detail forgotten to time), but no one else bid high enough to jack it up to such.
And that's how a relatively cheap $30 hat led me to a $578 jacket.
When I get the chance to upload decent pictures, I will hopefully do so in this very topic, so hopefully, I won't forget I posted this.
Going the tiniest bit off topic here, but the jacket section here doesn't seem to be catching much activity. It's like this place really hasn't grown. Does IndyGear basically dominate the online presence of Indy-related gear?
Also, has anyone else noticed that ProBoards ripped the Microsoft Windows XP BMP icon for the little Modify icon for posts? Just a little food-for-thought after-dinner mint to go along with my deep review.
I'll start by saying that I bought it used from a guy on eBay. He said he had it for three weeks and didn't like it because of the fit. I have no reason to doubt him, though I do wonder why he didn't simply return it. His loss and my gain, though, since I got a $300 discount just for three weeks of use, and he had other Indy jackets for sale, so it's possible he's encountered this before.
I'll start with perhaps the most important thing--the fit. If something doesn't fit, then no matter what, you're just not going to be happy with it. While the seller disclosed the size, I did by this used on eBay without being able to test-wear it, and the seller was upfront in the listing saying he wouldn't take returns. I went to their standard size chart to perform sizing checks to make sure the provided size would fit, though it matched my favorite and best-fitting sport coat in off-the-rack size, so I took the plunge. The jacket fit perfectly in every way I could imagine, and after a year and a half of wind, use, rain, and me trying to maintain my physique, it still fits perfectly. Gibson & Barnes easily has the most intelligent sizing of any jacket maker besides someone like the late Tony Nowak or Riley that does custom sizing exclusively. You can order to multiple even numbers, and you can go three lengths--short, regular, or tall. Most manufacturers don't even provide a short option. Of course, if you ask, they will also custom fit it like anyone else will, though that forfeits their return policy. This just further proves their versatility. U.S. Wings has very unintelligent sizing on most items. Just small, medium, large, x-large, xx-large, etc. No real way to specify fit. It's great it does happen to fit perfectly, but if not, too bad because there might not be anything in between. Wested provides more options, and is especially practical if you live in England and can spring for their custom fitting which isn't much money compared to most's offerings. However, if you don't live in their area and must order overseas, you can run into big issues and hassles if they got the sizing wrong. Of course, Wested may have cleared up their customer service issues since I was last here.
It would also be remiss of me to fail to mention that G&Bs customer service department will jump on any question you email them within hours and answer it completely and concisely with no end-around or vague answers.
The lambskin material itself.... After spending a lot of time here asking questions on how to best spec my jacket, I came to the ultimate conclusion that the best way to ensure I could ware my jacket in the largest diversity of climates, particularly considering where I live, lambskin would be best. Again, good choice. Call me nutty, but I find that I can actually wear it up to 100° F, though not without answering the occasional question from inquisitive people. It's certainly not like the heat-sink BiffMan seemed to describe here. With proper sweaters, layering, and a possible overcoat or pea coat (yes, you can fit a properly-sized pea coat over it if your particular jacket isn't over-sized), you can dip down to around freezing, though if you go too much below that, you might be wishing you had goatskin or something even stronger. Wearing the leather jacket in heat requires a few things. One of them is a cold-nature mentality that necessitates that you enjoy warm weather, such as myself. If you don't, it probably won't work out. You also have to be picky about the types of shirts you wear. Anything with long sleeves and you'll start to transform into bacon. Shirt collars, especially stiff ones or those awful polo shirt collars, will also act as a medical heat wrap for your neck, so forget that, as well. What you really need is one-layer only--a tee shirt (or henley if you prefer). I get ones with pockets not only for practicality, but to also to "spruce up" my image and not look lazy in my styling. Like thus, I actually find that, without zipping it up, it's actually cooler than if I had been wearing a basic undershirt with a regular long-sleeve shirt, buttoned or unbuttoned. The satin-like lining seems to help in this regard. Despite fears that it would be "clammy" in humidity and after sweating, I found that it actually has a semi-cooling effect against my bare arms. It also hasn't ever caught on my hands while taking it off or putting it on. Another factor is the fact that it's slightly roomier than a regular shirt (not to imply that it's over-sized or sized incorrectly, just that's it's sized like any normal jacket should be that fits properly--no one wants a skin-tight leather jacket that I know of). Point is, I've wore it everywhere in every kind of weather, and every kind of temperature that the average person will encounter, and it worked everywhere.
This is not at all to imply the lambskin is flimsy or fragile. It's certainly stronger than any shirt or sport coat you could buy. I've handled cats with it on before, and it's not something I'll do again. It's hit or miss in this regard--one cat began to struggle because it wanted down and actually slashed the left sleeve just beyond the shoulder. This didn't rip anything. It only left three small off-color distressed stripes that you really have to squint at and know they're there beforehand to even notice. There was no actual damage, tearing, or scratches on the surface. On the other hand, one other cat simply gripped the area close to the middle of the zipper-line. It left four tiny holes. No serious damage, but lesson learned--don't hold cats while wearing it. Other than this, it hasn't been damaged in the year and a half I've had it.
I mentioned the zipper earlier. After a few weeks of practice, I got to where I could grasp the zipper and zip it up slightly or all the way without it failing to catch properly or get stuck. It's smooth in operation. The left-hand "British" location of the pull doesn't phase me even slightly. It's as natural as if it was on the right.
I would like it to have Last Crusade-/Crystal Skull-style snaps at the top and bottom of the storm flap. Not a make-or-break deal, though, and the storm flap in general is a great idea for covering the zipper-line.
The front patch pockets are practical, too. Big enough that I can put stuff in them, and still have enough space to stuff my hands into the hand warmers. The underarm gussets are also a good idea.
One thing I have noticed is that the jacket has, at least as far as I can tell, distressed very little in the past year and a half, if at all. I also haven't noticed the jacket "deforming" to fit my body shape (not that it even needs to) like I've seen some of the members here talk about in reference to their own jackets. It's retained its color, which is the same rich dark brown that passes as black without proper lighting. It's also retained it's shape, though there are two faint and subtle lines along the front from hanging on a hanger. I got the biggest, broadest, and widest hanger I could find, not some small plastic hanger, or, heaven forbid, a wire hanger. I've heard of the pitfalls of using small plastic hangers. The lines themselves aren't notable while wearing it, and are only apparent while it's on the hanger. Like the claw marks, you have to know it's there in advance and where to look before you can notice it at all.
It's an interesting small little journey I took to get to this point. It started when I decided that I wanted a hat, but that a typical baseball cap lacked the sun protection of a regular hat, and that it wasn't as universally versatile. A cowboy/western hat fit the bill, but my wardrobe isn't western-themed, so that didn't seem perfect, either. Then I saw the Dorfman-Pacific oilcloth hat at a retailer. I recognized it immediately as Indiana Jones despite it not really being anything like an authentic hat. While I understand that Dorfman Pacific is at the low end in terms of authenticity, that wasn't my primary concern. I wanted a practical hat with a full brim that would shade my head and also provide versatile styling. I wear it out everywhere, from outdoors to public places to even church (though I obviously take it off once inside).
When the idea came to me what I wanted a practical jacket, I browsed the internet for options. That's how I discovered I could actually by my own Indy jacket. This is probably one of the last things that anyone here thinks about, but I actually choose the design for practicality and everyday-wear. Versatile in a wide range of climates. Quick zip-up design. Big pockets. It just does everything I want it to do.
Also, one of the last things I wanted was a flashy leather jacket that would make me stand out and attract undesired attention, so I wanted an understated design that would blend in in a crowd and not make myself look like a punk, someone that could club you at any moment, or someone that might be dealing in heroin. It does this, as well. I know this because I get far more comments from strangers about my "nice hat" than I do my Expedition. In fact, I've only gotten one such comment about my Expedition, and it was from a gentlemen operating an amusement park ride, asking if my jacket was too hot (the temperature was in the mid to upper 90s at the time).
While it's certainly true I bought the Expedition second hand, a scenario where I might have ended up with a jacket from any other manufacture, I must also point out that I had been searching eBay for months, and passed on a number of jackets. There were a number of U.S. Wings that had the wrong material, and those that had the correct material had the aforementioned ambiguous sizing. There were a number of Wested that were close in size, but were custom made and might have been wrong in one direction or another. Some had the wrong number of pockets, or something else wrong with the customizations that didn't set well. U.S. Wings even ran a special once--brand new Goatskin Indy jackets for $200, and not their imports--their "Signature Series" goatskins that were supposedly their best. I passed on that, as well. I could have gotten a brand new Todd's Costumes jacket for $150, but declined on that, as well (and this post was still fresh in memory, even though Kt. Templar's picture doesn't appear to be working, but for the curious, it showed one of his Todd's jacket's armpits having exploded). When I saw the G&B in that size, though... something just clicked. I knew it was the one. I put my bid out and got it for $200 (closer to $215 when you count the shipping, but that's going to happen with any manufacturer anyway). The fact that I was able to be confident enough with their sizing information and consistency despite buying second hand and not being able to try it before hand only goes to further demonstrate the simplicity of it all.
That's another thing that makes G&B great. If you go to their page, it's all very simple and laid out in front of you. You still have options and can still custom order if you want to, but you're not overwhelmed at the same time. If you go to U.S. Wings, you'll see a confusing number of models, and the same thing happens at Wested, though to an admittedly smaller degree. Really, the only thing wrong with their options is that you're limited to either lambskin or goatskin, and if you asked their customer service department, they might tell you that they're able to make it in their cowhide or horsehide as a custom made jacket.
In product reviews, I've found that most people will readily harp on a product if it's faulty or fails to deliver (like with the numerous Wested shipping issues in the past), but, and this might not necessarily be the case here, when a product is excellent and meets or exceeds expectations, people often find it harder to find the time to comment. I'm trying to buck that trend here, even if I seem somewhat-self absorbed. I want to establish an honest product review that may help prospective buyers.
I only own this one leather jacket, so I can't really say for sure if it or any other leather jacket is worth $500 (incidentally, the Expedition lambskin is now a $578 jacket due to Gibson & Barnes' price increase--they sure aren't skittish about telling you how good they think their jackets are). I've never spent that much, or even $200, on an article of clothing, and I can easily see someone choosing a U.S. Wings or Wested option because of the money involved. I will say that I'm extremely satisfied with my Expedition, and if you have the means and motivation to do something like this, you won't be choosing wrong if you choose G&B. It really goes to show that something is worth what you're willing to pay for it--my final bid was actually $275 (maybe $270, but that's a small detail forgotten to time), but no one else bid high enough to jack it up to such.
And that's how a relatively cheap $30 hat led me to a $578 jacket.
When I get the chance to upload decent pictures, I will hopefully do so in this very topic, so hopefully, I won't forget I posted this.
Going the tiniest bit off topic here, but the jacket section here doesn't seem to be catching much activity. It's like this place really hasn't grown. Does IndyGear basically dominate the online presence of Indy-related gear?
Also, has anyone else noticed that ProBoards ripped the Microsoft Windows XP BMP icon for the little Modify icon for posts? Just a little food-for-thought after-dinner mint to go along with my deep review.
Looking forward to the pics! 
